Violence in the Skies. Outraged!

[Digerati]

My bad. The incident is so similar.

I think the confusion comes from the fact they just released that guy's name yesterday.

 

[britechguy]

There you go again pretending to know what I want and mispresenting what I said.

There you go again claiming that when multiple people (see @A Guy's replies) take something from what you've said that they are the problem. We're not.

And then you engage in sophistry: "Now if you want to blame those "leaders" for "enabling", you might have a case."

Encouraging, enabling, indirectly exhorting are all cut from precisely the same cloth.

I make no apologies, none, for taking what you say at face value and drawing entirely reasonable conclusions from it.

 

[Will]

Except that is only the possible fine, not what they are actually getting. If you look at this FAA article from Aug 19, 2021, only 2 people were fined over $40K. The fine amount drops rapidly from there down to a slap on the wrist for just a small handful of offenders.

This is the same article I linked to, and it shows the fine for a plane diverting is $40K plus.

Only 2 planes were diverted - the rest of the incidents resulted in either the passenger being arrested on arrival (no diversion), or the plane returning to the gate (the incident occurring prior to takeoff).

 

[Will]

RE: the other comments in this thread -

Disruptive and aggressive passengers aren't a new phenomenon, on any mode of transport, and I think everyone here would agree that punching a flight attendant is unacceptable behaviour.

I'm not really sure this debate is going anywhere outside of that.

 

[Digerati]

This thread is not, and has never been about leaders enabling others to assault flight attendants. It is about individuals being unruly and attacking flight attendants. Even if they have leaders pulling their strings - something not shown is happening in these events - the individuals still need to be held responsible with commensurate penalties.

This is the same article I linked to, and it shows the fine for a plane diverting is $40K plus.

You are right, it is the same article, but I don't see where it shows the fines were for diverting a plane.

The fine in the first case was for, "for allegedly throwing objects, including his carry-on luggage, at other passengers; refusing to stay seated; lying on the floor in the aisle, refusing to get up, and then grabbing a flight attendant by the ankles and putting his head up her skirt."

The second was for "allegedly interfering with crewmembers after failing to comply with the facemask mandate; making non-consensual physical contact with another passenger; throwing a playing card at a passenger and threatening him with physical harm; making stabbing gestures towards certain passengers; and snorting what appeared to be cocaine from a plastic bag, which the cabin crew confiscated."

While it appears the second plane was diverted, it does not mention the first was. In any case, it appears the fines were for those other offenses.

In further reading, it does show where planes in other cases returned to the same airport or returned to the gate. While not diverting, the end result (the plane and its passengers unable to complete the flight as planned) is the same.

I'm not really sure this debate is going anywhere outside of that.

It was not intended to, that is for sure. And since this was my thread, and it has degraded and been diverted OT, I have closed it.

 

[jcgriff2]

Must be a privileged individual since he was flying first class.

You don't have to be "privileged" to fly 1st class, just pay a little more money! On one trip I made from John Wayne Airport in Santa Anna, Orange County, California, 1st class to Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, was just $250 more. On a 5+ hour flight, it is worth it.

I hope the FAA goes up to its limit and hits the guy with a $50,000 fine.

I would like to know the guy's blood-alcohol level (BAC). In the US, 0.08% is the limit for driving DUI.

However, I AM NOT in any way saying that the unruly passenger's behavior should be excused due to BAC level. He deserves a lifetime flying ban, regardless of age.

In 1st class, you board early, are seated and offered a drink, including champagne, which then flows in unlimited quantities for all 5+ hours in the air for free. (So.... it CAN BE worth an extra $250 ticket price!)

Add him to Homeland Security's no-fly list.

John

EDIT: I just read that the guy is 21 years old. How very sad for him to now [hopefully] be a "Domestic Terrorist" for life. It was his choice.